tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38085367.post1818097589246058515..comments2024-03-19T09:06:21.507-04:00Comments on Irtiqa: Mosque hysteria is shameful (and strategically idiotic)Salman Hameedhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04327330113822656571noreply@blogger.comBlogger7125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38085367.post-60865165332630325032010-08-25T10:57:39.203-04:002010-08-25T10:57:39.203-04:00Kate,
Yes, you are right. Now things have been bl...Kate,<br /><br />Yes, you are right. Now things have been blown so out of proportion that the Park 51 option is getting smaller and smaller. Perhaps, if they can wait out the primaries this fall, the political factor will most likely go away.Salman Hameedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04327330113822656571noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38085367.post-70942145044869847142010-08-23T23:42:10.390-04:002010-08-23T23:42:10.390-04:00Hi, Salman -
I know I’m a bit late in my comment...Hi, Salman - <br />I know I’m a bit late in my comments, but just wanted to add my two cents about this – as an NYC resident, I am repeatedly being surprised and saddened by what I am reading, seeing and hearing in terms of “anti-mosque” sentiment. I suppose on the positive side, it shows that I’m still an optimist about humanity. But on the negative side, I am finding it very hard to NOT tear my hair out in frustration. (I have read a good book – “Us and Them: The Science of Identity” – that reminds me that the Us vs. Them mentality is deeply, deeply ingrained, and can be based on pretty much anything, including race, religion, sports team, and even shirt color.) <br /><br />Imam Rauf has been such a rock star to me (yes: rock star) for so many years for his work in interfaith understanding that I can’t understand why everyone doesn’t realize he’s amazing, and that his proposed project would be a wonderful addition to this incredibly diverse city. Especially since the responses so clearly demonstrate the need for improved communication and relationships between Muslims and non-Muslims. I am trying to tell myself that – as with the Religious Right – the loudest folks who get the media coverage do NOT speak for everyone. But I still find the poll results disappointing. (63% opposition in NYC? Really??? Jeez – did they include any Muslims in that poll?)<br /><br />And now – although I hate to say it – I’m even starting to think that they should reconsider the location – even though I think that would mean a victory for fear/hatred/religious intolerance. I just don’t know how it’s going to turn for the better otherwise. New Yorkers are very attached to their 9/11 experiences and sentiments, and the amazing unity we experienced in the few days and weeks immediately following 9/11 has definitely vanished, especially with the wars. There has been a lot of Us vs. Them, in all kinds of combinations. But Imam Rauf and Daisy Khan both seem to be more optimistic than I am, seeing this as an opportunity for increased communication and understanding. Bless them. I am still trying to figure out the best way I can make a difference without succumbing to the temptation to go to the protests and bonk people on the head. (I do understand that will not progress us further along the road to peace. The little Buddhist in my head is still trying to reason with the little demon who shares the space.) So I’m trying to think of alternatives, and to visualize ideas involving compassion, communication, respectful listening, education, and a sense of humor (with thanks again to Jon Stewart). <br /><br />Suggestions are welcome.Katehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06339625576015409611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38085367.post-25042690357992625242010-08-18T14:56:31.563-04:002010-08-18T14:56:31.563-04:00"Given all the fuss I expected a domed thing ..."Given all the fuss I expected a domed thing with minarets, perhaps verses from the Koran in decorative Arabic calligraphy and such visible at the front and that the City was called to interfere and prevent its building on those grounds (ie the billboard example)."<br /><br />Yup - no visible signs or anything like that. All this fuss is for short-term political gains - and this is the reason why this is crazy.Salman Hameedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04327330113822656571noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38085367.post-88570693366628465342010-08-18T11:57:55.709-04:002010-08-18T11:57:55.709-04:00Oh I should point out that just I went and looked ...Oh I should point out that just I went and looked at pictures of what the thing is supposed to look like. It looks like a rectangular building with lots of glass. Is that so? Given all the fuss I expected a domed thing with minarets, perhaps verses from the Koran in decorative Arabic calligraphy and such visible at the front and that the City was called to interfere and prevent its building on those grounds (ie the billboard example).Bulent Murtezaoglunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38085367.post-29794814710104468152010-08-18T11:43:27.775-04:002010-08-18T11:43:27.775-04:00Yeah, I realize the discussion is not even close t...Yeah, I realize the discussion is not even close to that level, but it ought to be and it can be. I do think justifying muddled thinking and PR efforts for whatever lofty aim is a dangerous application of ends justify the means. <br /><br />Now, if <i>I</i> were to get manipulative -- but no less principled -- I'd point out that allowing that building to be built in some form regardless of the ideology of its owners is <i>as American as</i> having the National Socialist Party of America holding their rally in Skokie, IL. We know this is not a hard principle for Americans to understand because they have understood it in the past and -- imho not too unjustifiably -- many took pride in it. If the group isn't breaking any laws, it can exist and do its thing, own and operate building etc. <i>under the protection of the law</i>.Bulent Murtezaoglunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38085367.post-80041065304370609222010-08-18T11:22:52.717-04:002010-08-18T11:22:52.717-04:00Bulent,
I actually agree with you on the Iraq com...Bulent,<br /><br />I actually agree with you on the Iraq comment. At the same time the lack of understanding amongst the general population did help in getting the backing for a particular political agenda - and in convincing people that there was a link between 9/11 plotters and Saddam Hussain. <br /><br />"And, here's the thing if people want to take a truly principled stance: do not argue that this particular set of Muslims have compatible values to Western ones, argue that even if they didn't they still have the right to build their building. This will probably fail to be convincing much in the same way freedom of speech arguments fail for public billboards. "<br /><br />I think we are not even close to this level of discussion. <br /><br />But I do think that this is an issue (or at least has now become an issue) of global strategic importance. From that perspective, I think the decision should be pretty straight forward.Salman Hameedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04327330113822656571noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-38085367.post-23746589042092526602010-08-18T09:52:41.730-04:002010-08-18T09:52:41.730-04:00This is ridiculous:
Had the George W. Bush admini...This is ridiculous:<br /><br /><i>Had the George W. Bush administration been more aware of the irreconcilable differences between the Salafist jihadists of Al Qaeda and the secular Baathists of Saddam Hussein’s Iraq, the United States might never have blundered into a disastrous war, and instead kept its focus on rebuilding post-Taliban Afghanistan while the hearts and minds of the Afghans were still open to persuasion.</i><br /><br />There's almost nothing there that makes sense or fits the facts. Punditry for a mosque or whatever is one thing, asserting such nonsense is quite another. We don't know why GWB's administration wanted to invade Iraq, but it is pretty clear it wasn't due to a <i>misunderstanding</i>. We don't know why they neglected Afghanistan, but it is clear they are capable of walking and chewing gum at the same time. <br /><br />I will also point out that this particular paper, the NYT, apologized to its readers for its role in securing public support/consent for the Iraq war. It didn't look like <i>they</i> were misunderstanding anything back then either, they were just siding with power and aiding the administration's effort. An Islamic center or whatever couldn't have fixed that problem, because the sheer lack of integrity evident in their reporting was not caused by lack of information but at the very least a willingness to bend and comply. The proposed center cannot insert backbones into people who have willingly had theirs removed. <br />It looks like what NYC really needs is a public school for spin avoidance and a public center for exposing obscurantism in punditry. <br /><br />And, here's the thing if people want to take a truly principled stance: do not argue that this particular set of Muslims have compatible values to Western ones, argue that even if they didn't they still have the right to build their building. This will probably fail to be convincing much in the same way freedom of speech arguments fail for public billboards. <br /><br />I have no opinion as to what should be done with that plot of land given the public sentiment. If it were up to me I'd just apply the regular zoning and permit criteria and make sure that the local law enforcement protected the building against violent action. Obviously it isn't as simple as that, though.Bulent Murtezaoglunoreply@blogger.com